Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sachal Afzal
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 03:29, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
Sachal Afzal[edit]
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- Sachal Afzal (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Another BLP on a non-notable actor created by BeauSuzanne (talk · contribs) who has a dubious editing history. The subject does not meet criteria outlined in the relevant WP:NACTOR as well basic WP:GNG. No evidence indicating significant roles in notable films, TV dramas, etc. Merely being in a film or TV drama does not make one Inherently notable. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 19:55, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Pakistan-related deletion discussions. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 19:55, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 20:32, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
- Keep. Sachal was a well known model before starting his acting career. The sources Express Tribune and The news International have written about his modeling career and also his background too.(BeauSuzanne (talk) 07:14, 1 May 2024 (UTC))
- As the creator of this BLP, you've to provide references to support claims made about her significant roles. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 09:25, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
- In these sources both are news international mentions his career and education. His significant roles are in dramas Mannat Murad, Sara Sajeeda, Bakhtawar, Adawat and Zulm.(BeauSuzanne (talk) 11:11, 1 May 2024 (UTC))[1][2]
- As the creator of this BLP, you've to provide references to support claims made about her significant roles. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 09:25, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
References
- ^ "More than meets the eye". The News International.
- ^ "Sachal Afzal". The News International.
These paid interviews = primary sources. Do you have any substantial evidence ? —Saqib (talk | contribs) 11:24, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
- It's not a paid interviews. The News International newspapers has interviewed many other actors and models too and it writes every important news. The News International is owned by Jang News Group which is one of the oldest newspaper in Pakistan. The News International is a major English newspaper in Pakistan.(BeauSuzanne (talk) 12:03, 1 May 2024 (UTC))
- I'm not questioning the credibility of the sources, but rather the interviews themselves. While it's common for actors to be interviewed, these interviews alone may not sufficiently demonstrate that the subject meets the WP:GNG or WP:N. Additionally, these interviews (primary coverage) are not sufficient to verify claims of significant roles in TV dramas/films —Saqib (talk | contribs) 12:23, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
- As someone who contributed to this page, how can we substantiate if these itws were "staged" or not, and if we can't, shouldn't we assume that the default position is that they aren't ? Also he's one of the leading male models of the country and one of the rising actors as well (secondary roles in the leading productions of the country), he has awards and nominations in both fields, shouldn't that be enough to assert his "credibility" ? Metamentalist (talk) 16:17, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- Its essential to apply WP:COMMONSENSE when assessing coverage to asses its credibility. In this instance, the coverage seems to align more with WP:NEWSORGINDIA and exhibits characteristics of WP:CHURNALISM-style reporting.Your statement seems to suggest WP:ILIKEIT. To substantiate your stance, you'd need to provide evidence demonstrates the subject meets WP:N —Saqib (talk | contribs) 16:26, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- "The News International" is a credible newspaper of the country, not some "yellow journalism" directed towards rumors about celebrities or something, so I was submitting the proposition that the first assumption should be positive and not negative, and my second point is that even if you do admit the source are refutable the man is still one of the best known male models in the country as well young actors (as substantiated by awards and nominations, also sourced). Metamentalist (talk) 19:08, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- It's not that The News itself isn't reliable, but rather this specific piece which doesn't quite cut it to meet WP:RS and establish subject's WP:N. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 19:14, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- But that info is confirmed by another source (Express Tribune, also "credible") & also does that impact the fact that the WP:N is met by the fact that he's one of the most awarded male models of the country + an actor in some of the country's most watched dramas produced by the best known media houses ? Metamentalist (talk) 19:23, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- BeauSuzanne and Metamentalist The subject clearly fails to meet the GNG, and neither of you has been able to provide solid evidence thus far. When examining this through the lens of WP:NACTOR, a Google search also hasn't yielded anything substantial to prove that the dramas/films in which he acted are
significant works
. Therefore, the subject fails to meet the NACTOR - even if he played lead roles in them, BUT I haven't seen verification of that either. It appears he only did MINOR roles, and I can say this with certainty. —Saqib (talk I contribs) 21:00, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
- BeauSuzanne and Metamentalist The subject clearly fails to meet the GNG, and neither of you has been able to provide solid evidence thus far. When examining this through the lens of WP:NACTOR, a Google search also hasn't yielded anything substantial to prove that the dramas/films in which he acted are
- But that info is confirmed by another source (Express Tribune, also "credible") & also does that impact the fact that the WP:N is met by the fact that he's one of the most awarded male models of the country + an actor in some of the country's most watched dramas produced by the best known media houses ? Metamentalist (talk) 19:23, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- It's not that The News itself isn't reliable, but rather this specific piece which doesn't quite cut it to meet WP:RS and establish subject's WP:N. —Saqib (talk | contribs) 19:14, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- "The News International" is a credible newspaper of the country, not some "yellow journalism" directed towards rumors about celebrities or something, so I was submitting the proposition that the first assumption should be positive and not negative, and my second point is that even if you do admit the source are refutable the man is still one of the best known male models in the country as well young actors (as substantiated by awards and nominations, also sourced). Metamentalist (talk) 19:08, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- Its essential to apply WP:COMMONSENSE when assessing coverage to asses its credibility. In this instance, the coverage seems to align more with WP:NEWSORGINDIA and exhibits characteristics of WP:CHURNALISM-style reporting.Your statement seems to suggest WP:ILIKEIT. To substantiate your stance, you'd need to provide evidence demonstrates the subject meets WP:N —Saqib (talk | contribs) 16:26, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- As someone who contributed to this page, how can we substantiate if these itws were "staged" or not, and if we can't, shouldn't we assume that the default position is that they aren't ? Also he's one of the leading male models of the country and one of the rising actors as well (secondary roles in the leading productions of the country), he has awards and nominations in both fields, shouldn't that be enough to assert his "credibility" ? Metamentalist (talk) 16:17, 5 May 2024 (UTC)
- I'm not questioning the credibility of the sources, but rather the interviews themselves. While it's common for actors to be interviewed, these interviews alone may not sufficiently demonstrate that the subject meets the WP:GNG or WP:N. Additionally, these interviews (primary coverage) are not sufficient to verify claims of significant roles in TV dramas/films —Saqib (talk | contribs) 12:23, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete: Promo BLP, fails GNG and NBIO. Sources in article do not meet WP:SIRS addressing the subject directly and indepth, are mainly promo bios, interviews, and name mentions in routine mill news, BEFORE found nothing that meets WP:SIRS. Above sources are interviews, [1]. BLPs require strong sourcing. // Timothy :: talk 19:32, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 23:18, 7 May 2024 (UTC)Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 07:49, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
*Keep - Award winning model and an actor. Meets WP:GNG.Sameeerrr (talk) 16:05, 16 May 2024 (UTC) (
Blocked sockpuppet) S0091 (talk) 14:56, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete: Both of The News articles are interviews that mostly rely on what Afzal says so are primary, as is Geo News. Galaxy Lollywood is a WP:blog so cannot be used to establish notability and likely should not be used at all. Same for HI! which specifically states their content may not be accurate so fails WP:REPUTABLE. Other sources are brief mentions or not in-depth. S0091 (talk) 16:32, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
- Delete - I do not see anything as far as reliable sources that would show notability and the !keep votes have not presented anything that would. --CNMall41 (talk) 18:23, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.