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[–][deleted]  (4 children)

[deleted]

    [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

    Such is what people have been saying for years, and it is surely correct. But has anyone checked? (Everything is 'obvious' until suddenly it's false.) That's the point of this exercise and asking whether anyone knows of cases I may have missed.

    [–][deleted]  (2 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]glassuser 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      Sure, your assertion makes sense. But does anything about US drug policy make sense?

      [–]Augustus_Trollus_III 2 points3 points  (8 children)

      threadjacking here:

      Weight loss Studies on modafinil (even those on healthy weight individuals) indicate that it has an appetite reducing/weight loss effect.[56][67][68][69][70] All studies on modafinil in the Medline database that are for one month or longer which report weight changes find that modafinil users experience weight loss compared to placebo.[71] In 2008, one small-scale study on individuals performing simulated shift work quantified the effect as a 18% decrease in total caloric intake on 200 mg/day, and a 38% decrease on 400 mg/day.[72] However, the prescribing information for Provigil notes that "There were no clinically significant differences in body weight change in patients treated with PROVIGIL compared to placebo-treated patients in the placebo-controlled clinical trials." [73] In experimental studies, the appetite reducing effect of modafinil appears to be similar to that of amphetamines, but, unlike amphetamines, the dose of modafinil that is effective at decreasing food intake does not significantly increase heart rate. Also, an article published in the Annals of Clinical Psychiatry, presented the case of a 280 pound patient (BMI=35.52) who lost 40 pounds over the course of a year on Modafinil (to 30.44 BMI). After three years, his weight stabilized at a 50 pound weight loss (29.59 BMI). The authors conclude that placebo controlled studies should be conducted on using Modafinil as a weight loss agent.[67] Conversely, a US patent (#6,455,588) on using modafinil as an appetite stimulating agent has been filed by Cephalon in 2000.

      Can anyone comment on it's efficacy as a weight loss drug? Wikipedia says it's subject to customs in Canada, is that dangerous for the buyer?

      [–][deleted]  (1 child)

      [deleted]

        [–]Augustus_Trollus_III 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        So you become more focused?

        [–]Brukhar1 1 point2 points  (3 children)

        Yes, I can confirm the efficacy for weight loss, you can read my post about it here: http://www.reddit.com/r/Nootropics/comments/ov5u7/update_modafinil_modalert_experience/

        [–]Augustus_Trollus_III 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        thanks, that was an excellent post. I may have to try that for the appetite suppression effects.

        [–]catherinecc 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        FWIW, I noticed little to no appetite suppression, although I was incredibly depressed when I took it regularly and used binge eating to cope (so I'm not really the ideal person to compare yourself against)

        Taking it did break me out of a cycle of sleeping 20 hours a day and helped me become more or less functional though. I've never been super motivated while on it though.

        [–]juryben 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        I can confirm as well. I'm on my 3rd day and took 50mg at 11:30am. I haven't even thought about food all day and it's 5:45pm.

        [–]Augustus_Trollus_III 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        http://gwern.net/Modafinil#costs

        ndeed, modafinil's relative lack of side-effects has led to it being called the most perfect nootropic around, in the etymological sense of a drug which has no bad aspects and only improves the mind. But there is no free lunch, after all. (There may be bargain lunches which we are thrilled to buy, but they aren't free. If they were, why didn't Evolution grab them already? For discussion of how drugs can be bargain lunches, see Drug heuristics.)

        Anecdotally, the real troll under the bridge for modafinil seems to be that one can develop tolerance, where it no longer has the stimulant or anti-sleep effects that made it so awesome. For example, poker player Paul Phillips took 2-300mg daily for a long period and said the effects "have attenuated over time. The body is an amazing adjusting machine, and there's no upside that I've been able to see to just taking more."

        [–]judasblue 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Troll under a bridge or upside depends on your point of view. I personally am a big fan of shit that says "you know, you probably need to cycle off this for a while" and taking more of it won't do dick. My off button for stimulants doesn't work all that well, and while moda is exceptionally weak as real stimulants go, I actually like the fact that past X point taking more doesn't make the machine go faster. If it didn't work that way, I probably wouldn't be taking it, despite my doctors wanting me on it.

        [–]wantsomemore 3 points4 points  (1 child)

        A friend of mine passed out in his car after drinking and had a modafinil on him. He was busted with a felony. So yes, I know of one.

        [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Busted = charged? What happened to him? Do you have the case name?

        [–]00000000000000000000 -1 points0 points  (8 children)

        I think at worst they would hit you with a nominal fine

        [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 0 points1 point  (7 children)

        Tell that to Kendrick Wagner, eh?

        [–]00000000000000000000 0 points1 point  (3 children)

        Did he even have a lawyer? Do you have a link to his case?

        [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

        Yes.

        [–]00000000000000000000 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        ok lets see the link

        [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        I already provided it in the OP section. You can look up his lawyer's name yourself - the Missouri system is Javascript-based or something and makes it hard to get any static link.

        [–]noopeptaddict 0 points1 point  (2 children)

        Oh my god! Good reminder to me not to do anything like that! Talk about cruel and unusual punishment...

        [–]gwerngwern.net[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        I commented on IRC as I was reading the appeal that it reminded me of stories about poor people just blowing off bills and summons, and that is what ruins their lives and lands them on the streets - some strange weakness of will. (I'm not immune to this akrasia, but so far the consequences have never been quite so epic.)

        I mean, if you knew that missing sentencing was going to cost you a year in jail, wouldn't you just walk to the courtroom, even if it were 40 miles away, if you really couldn't arrange any kin of transportation?

        [–]noopeptaddict 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Good point. Also would have taken out a loan to get a good lawyer! You have a great point in fact. But still a good reminder to stay away from unnecessary contact with controlled substances.