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all 128 comments

[–]davratta 176 points177 points  (79 children)

Ancient Egyptians used a headrest. There are stone examples that date back to the Old Kingdom, but most are made out of wood and date to the Roman period of Egypt history. http://www.globalegyptianmuseum.org/glossary.aspx?id=174

[–][deleted] 60 points61 points  (7 children)

They were used throughout Africa, and still are to this day in some tribes. Source: NY Natural History Museum. Went there last year. Left kicking and screaming.

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    [–]Xorg_Xalargsky 23 points24 points  (4 children)

    Are there reasons for this (a pile of hay must more confortable)? Is it purely cultural? For material reasons (protection from climbing insects, better airflow around the head...)?

    [–]shobble 7 points8 points  (1 child)

    There's an interesting article here in which the author gives a brief history and iterates a number of designs, which apparently aren't too uncomfortable.

    Quoting:

    The back of your head is hard bone and cushioned by hair in a way the side of your head (with its squishy ears) is not.

    I wonder if hair length/style plays any significant part in their comfort or popularity?

    [–]Antlerbot 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    I remember reading that geisha used head rests because their hair was so elaborate and difficult to style that they didn't want to have to do it every day, and a head rest preserved the style while they slept, so you're probably on to something.

    [–]psychguy 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    I believe there is an exhibit at the Field Museum in Chicago that explains that headrests made more sense in the Egyptian climate, but I don't remember the details. I think it had to do with airflow.

    [–]tannis21 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I remember reading somewhere that it was to help prevent lice and other vermin.... piles of hay of feathers would attract bugs so sleeping on a neck rest was considered cleaner

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                [–]Truthfull 33 points34 points  (1 child)

                They are still used in some parts of Ethiopia, and from experience they aren't all that bad.

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                          [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 22 points23 points  (6 children)

                          All of these posts are going to be deleted.

                          :o

                          [–]BraveOmeter 43 points44 points  (4 children)

                          I wish that when these posts were deleted, the Mod that did it left a blurb about which rule was violated. Partly so people better learn the rules, partly to satisfy curiosities.

                          [–]NMWMilitary History 12 points13 points  (2 children)

                          Very often we do, but when as many posts have to be deleted as have in this thread (50+ at my count) it isn't always possible to do that efficiently. We're experimenting with some new tools that may make this easier in the near future, but in the meantime it's going to mostly be catch-as-catch-can.

                          In threads where only one or two comments have to be removed, notes about why will be the norm; in threads like this one, which has been inexplicably and especially awful, not so much.

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                            [–]lafore 23 points24 points  (28 children)

                            I know the Bible records Jacob as having used a stone for a pillow, and I was never sure why he would do that. But it does at least show pillows showing up in stories from long ago.

                            [–][deleted] 37 points38 points  (24 children)

                            Have you ever slept on the ground? Especially on your side? I slept on the floor for years (it makes me feel great when I wake up, no joke) and quickly learned that if you don't put something - and by something I mean anything - under your head, particularly while on your side, you're going to have a bad time.

                            Edit - I a word.

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                              [–]lafore 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                              Good Point. I always just thought he would find something else, but I guess he was pretty far out there and about all he had was rocks.

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                                                    [–]th3guys2 6 points7 points  (0 children)

                                                    I don't feel that this actually answered what the OP asked for. It (somewhat) answered the first half about "what people used before pillows", but not the second half of "where did the modern idea of a pillow come from".

                                                    [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                                                    I saw oen of these in the museum in Cairo. They have stone ones and little wood ones on a peg. Boy they look uncomfortable. I reckon if you used one you could only sleep on your back, but they were about 3-4 inches off the surface of the bed which seems kind of high.

                                                    As a belly sleeper I don't know what I would do in ancient Egypt.

                                                    [–]yurigoul 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                                                    Does what I heard about the chinese japanese book 'The pillow book' fit into this? For those who do not know it: it is the story of a concubine who wrote it down on a book in her 'pillow' aka known as a headrest that also had room for stuff like a book.

                                                    [–]prophane33 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                                                    The pillow book is Japanese.

                                                    [–]yurigoul 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                                                    Oops :-)

                                                    [–]thatfreakygirl 112 points113 points  (2 children)

                                                    The Etruscan burial mounds (800-500 BC) include carvings of what a home looked like. The bedrooms included pillows.

                                                    This is the one I'm thinking of, though that picture is painfully small you can kind of make out the pillow.

                                                    Unfortunately, the material is impossible to determine (as they're carved in stone) but the picture half way down on Boston's Museum of Fine Arts website here shows a sarcophagus with a carved pillow that is bent against the headboard which would seem to imply that they are a soft (or at least pliable) material.

                                                    edit: Found a slightly better picture of a burial mound bedroom carving: here

                                                    [–]ruairihair 46 points47 points  (2 children)

                                                    What I would be interested to know is if the pillow came before or after the bed...?

                                                    [–]cielol 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                                                    Depends on how you define bed, I suppose, but in general pillows were found significantly before. Raised beds were originally an aristocratic thing, it combined with the canopy to provide the lord and lady a bit of privacy in an environment where they were likely to be having people sleeping on the floor in the same room with them. Everyone else living in the noble house pretty much slept on the ground.

                                                    Other things you could argue are beds are cots, which were found in ancient Egypt, but that's also where we get a lot of our early pillows. I'm not sure of comparative dates off the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure that the headrests came earlier. Stuffed mattresses probably count too, which I honestly have no idea - I think that got sort of skipped over in Europe and people pretty much went straight from sleeping on the floor (if you lived in the lord's house) or straw (if you lived on a farm) to beds like the aristocrats, but I'm working off scanty memories here. I know straw was a relatively common bed, but it was generally more like a pile with a cloth on top. If you're making a bed out of straw you generally want to replace the straw every so often, so I presume that between that and the fact that straw generally stays in place, it wasn't worth making all four sides of the container. Places like Japan where the bed material was more beadlike seem much more likely to develop stuffed mattresses.

                                                    If you're talking about creating a more comfortable place to sleep on in general, though, both pillows and beds precede history, so it's hard to say. Early pillows (that we know about, keeping in mind that soft material doesn't last as long) are carved headrests made of wood or stone, so I'd probably argue them, considering how long it took for people to stop sleeping on the floor. But at that point it is speculation.

                                                    [–]slawkenbergius 19 points20 points  (3 children)

                                                    I've read that 18th century Europeans slept in a position closer to the one we'd associate with sitting up in bed. I don't remember the book, though.

                                                    Also, from the Zhuangzi ("Perfect Enjoyment," which is one of the Outer Chapters, so probably around 200 BC):

                                                    When Zhuangzi went to Chu, he saw an empty skull, bleached indeed, but still retaining its shape. Tapping it with his horse-switch, he asked it, saying, 'Did you, Sir, in your greed of life, fail in the lessons of reason, and come to this? Or did you do so, in the service of a perishing state, by the punishment of the axe? Or was it through your evil conduct, reflecting disgrace on your parents and on your wife and children? Or was it through your hard endurances of cold and hunger? Or was it that you had completed your term of life?' Having given expression to these questions, he took up the skull, and made a pillow of it when he went to sleep.

                                                    At midnight the skull appeared to him in a dream, and said, 'What you said to me was after the fashion of an orator. All your words were about the entanglements of men in their lifetime. There are none of those things after death. Would you like to hear me, Sir, tell you about death?' 'I should,' said Zhuangzi, and the skull resumed: 'In death there are not (the distinctions of) ruler above and minister below. There are none of the phenomena of the four seasons. Tranquil and at ease, our years are those of heaven and earth. No king in his court has greater enjoyment than we have.' Zhuangzi did not believe it, and said, 'If I could get the Ruler of our Destiny to restore your body to life with its bones and flesh and skin, and to give you back your father and mother, your wife and children, and all your village acquaintances, would you wish me to do so?' The skull stared fixedly at him, knitted its brows, and said, 'How should I cast away the enjoyment of my royal court, and undertake again the toils of life among mankind?'

                                                    The Classical Chinese here is 枕--literally a pillow or head-rest. So they did exist.

                                                    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

                                                    I've read that 18th century Europeans slept in a position closer to the one we'd associate with sitting up in bed. I don't remember the book, though.

                                                    That's almost certainly false. Any and all 18th century beds and bed designs I've ever seen are flat, as our beds today. Some quick googling turns up several resources regarding beds from the 18th century being flat:

                                                    Bed design Book.

                                                    These guys create 18th century reproduction beds - they're all flat.

                                                    Also worth considering are the antique furniture and reproductions at Versailles, the Louvre, Boston Museum of Art - all have bed pieces from either the 18c or right around it, and they're all flat.

                                                    [–]quince23 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                                                    I think he may have been thinking of the use of bolsters, which were used to prop up sleepers to almost a sitting position. They were used in the ~14th century on in medieval Europe. The beds themselves were still flat, you just had specialized pillows propping you up at the head. I can't tell you when they died out, but you're right that they certainly weren't popular in the late 17th or 18th centuries.

                                                    [–]slawkenbergius 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                                                    Huh, good to know, thanks!

                                                    [–]pianoplayer98 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                                                    Some of the Chinese would use an ornate headrest carved out of solid jade. They're actually still quite common in China for therapeutic uses.

                                                    [–]PuTongHua 9 points10 points  (13 children)

                                                    Not exactly historical itself, but the Genesis story of Jacob's ladder to heaven has him using a rock to support his head as he sleeps. Does the stone of Jacob suggest people in ancient times were used to head support, even if it was just a rock?

                                                    [–]Narcoleptic_Narwhal 11 points12 points  (11 children)

                                                    Being no Bibblical scholar, I would have to ask: Would "a rock" be a translation issue in defining the Egyptian style of headrest, that seem to have been made from stone or wood? I don't know that particular story, so if he is out in the field I suppose that is a moot question.

                                                    [–]onlyprevost 13 points14 points  (1 child)

                                                    The idea is that he is in between settlements in the wilderness in this story. The word used is the traditional word for Rock, eben, triliteral root aleph-bet-nun. That word comes from the primitive hebrew word banah ( triliteral root bet, nun, he) to build. Source: BDB Hebrew lexicon entry for the hebrew triliteral root.

                                                    [–]Narcoleptic_Narwhal 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                                                    Probably a much more thorough answer to that than I ever expected. Thank you for that!

                                                    [–]dexmonic 0 points1 point  (8 children)

                                                    Why would you think this is the case?

                                                    [–]Narcoleptic_Narwhal 5 points6 points  (7 children)

                                                    Because I have come across situations like that before in biblical interpretation, where the way a word that was translated either had an archaic or hard-to-translate-the-meaning-of sort of deal, and subsequently could cause confusion on what exactly was meant (in the action sense, not a spiritual sense).

                                                    As I said, I don't know the bible well at all to understand the context, but /u/onlyprevost answered the question perfectly.

                                                    [–]dexmonic -4 points-3 points  (6 children)

                                                    "Would "a rock" be a translation issue in defining the Egyptian style of headrest, that seem to have been made from stone or wood?"

                                                    Rock=stone=rock. Stone is made of rock, no? I was just wondering if you actually had reasoning to believe that this word was translated incorrectly other than "well they translated other stuff incorrectly". I would be curious as to know what was translated in such a poor way that you question every single word in the bible?

                                                    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

                                                    This is from a post I did more than a month ago in /r/Christianity on the translation of Lucifer:

                                                    In Hebrew the word is הילל, which is helel/heylel: morning star. When St. Jerome translated the works into Latin, which would become the Vulgate, he used "Lucifer", which means "morning star".

                                                    Actually, in the Vulgate, the word "lucifer" occurs four times: Job 11:17, Job 38:32, Isaiah 14:12, and 2 Peter 1:19.

                                                    In Job 11:17 the Hebrew is בקר, boqehr/bokehr, which means morning.

                                                    In Job 38:32 the Hebrew is ‏מזרות, mazzaroth, which is another word which occurs only once in the Bible. It means "constellations" (also, maybe crowns but most of us are sure it means constellations).

                                                    In Peter 1:19 the Greek is φωσφόρος. I do not know Greek but I am told this is phosphoros, day star.

                                                    There are quite a lot of examples of really very poor translations among many Christianized texts. This is just one.

                                                    [–]dexmonic -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

                                                    Right, I was just wondering what clues about this particular situation made him think that the translation was because of the writers inability to understand egyptian headrest in a competent enough manner to describe it accurately, and instead just wrote the word rock. It seemed like a very far stretch to make simply because there had been poor translations in other areas of the bible.

                                                    Also, from your example, most of those words do have very similar or related meanings, what exactly is the poor translation in the example you showed? Not trying to be picky or contrary, I just got back from the bar so my thinking is a little slow and I must not be catching it right away.

                                                    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                                                    First, I don't know who keeps downvoting you as your questions are appropriate.

                                                    It seemed like a very far stretch to make simply because there had been poor translations in other areas of the bible.

                                                    It is important to remain critical of information we have, even in circumstances where we are confident that we have the correct answers. When we cease to be curious we cease to expand our knowledge.

                                                    Also, from your example, most of those words do have very similar or related meanings, what exactly is the poor translation in the example you showed?

                                                    Isaiah 14:12 demonstrates the point of that post and the discussion we were having at that time. It reads:

                                                    How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

                                                    In Christianity there is a demigod-style entity which opposes God and obstructs His plans. This entity is named "Satan". There is lack of evidence of a Christianized Satan in the Tanakh (Christian Old Testament) which has caused many Christian apologists to attempt to provide proofs of his existence prior to Jesus' teachings.

                                                    My issues are less with St. Jerome's translations and more with how Christianity as a whole has adapted them into these proofs. Isaiah 14:12 is an example of this. Many modern Christians continue to cite these translations as Satan's literal fall from Heaven when, in reality, they refer to Venus (the "morning star", it can often be seen by the naked eye in the early morning sky as a very bright star).

                                                    [–]dexmonic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                                                    Ah ok, thanks for the clarification. Theology is pretty interesting (and confusing) and my knowledge of early christianity is limited to my history 101 class in college. Again, thanks for taking the time to clarify, if my downvotes are any indication I was doing a very poor job of stating my intentions.

                                                    [–]Narcoleptic_Narwhal 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                                                    I think you're trying to make this into a larger thing than it is.

                                                    The connection for me was the headrest is made of stone. Perhaps during translation there was not yet an adequate word to translate what exactly the headrest thing was, without knowing what they are actually called. It's not limited to just the bible. As others have pointed out, though, a rock is pretty comfortable all things considered.

                                                    Either way, someone qualified answered my curiosity, so this is rather pointless to continue.

                                                    [–]dexmonic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                                                    As others have pointed out, though, a rock is pretty comfortable all things considered.

                                                    Have you ever tried sleeping on a rock? Haha, I guess if you feel this is pointless then it is, have a good day.

                                                    [–]dkgi -68 points-67 points  (7 children)

                                                    And while we're at it, can somebody explain where multi-layer toilet paper came from? (Serious question)

                                                    [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 27 points28 points  (2 children)

                                                    Please do not post completely unrelated questions in another user's thread. If you would like to know an answer to this or some other question, please feel free to make your own submission.

                                                    [–]dkgi 8 points9 points  (1 child)

                                                    I figured from the downvotes that I've probably violated the ettiquette. Sorry about that...

                                                    [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                                                    Quite alright, and really do please ask it if you're still interested!

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                                                      [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 20 points21 points  (2 children)

                                                      Please do not post completely unrelated questions in another user's thread. If you would like to know an answer to this or some other question, please feel free to make your own submission.

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                                                        [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                                                        We aren't really interested in making fun of people or jokes for their own sake in /r/AskHistorians, no -- try to always be helping the OP get a useful answer to the question that was asked, no matter what you post.

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                                                                  [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 11 points12 points  (3 children)

                                                                  It is absolutely being downvoted for being irrelevant. Have you spent much time in /r/AskHistorians before? Our readers tend to respond severely to this sort of thing, as they should, and they're doing it here right now.

                                                                  Again, this is not about the validity of his opinion, but rather its relevance. If he wishes to leave this subreddit, he's welcome to do so -- but a question about the history of pillows is not the place to air that grievance and nobody here is interested in reading it.

                                                                  I am going to be removing the entirety of this quite pointless digression; my reply to you here is for your own benefit, as you seem to still have questions to ask. If you wish to continue this further, please send a message to the mod mail so that your complaints may find their appropriate venue and you need not worry further about being downvoted.

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                                                                    [–]NMWMilitary History 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                                                                    You aren't missing much. "I slept with my head on a phone book once when I was drunk and it wasn't so bad! AMA" Lots of that kind of comment.

                                                                    [–]Sinisa26 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                                                                    On second thought, I'm sure I would regret reading it.

                                                                    P.S. Thanks for policing the subs so well!

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                                                                                  [–]NMWMilitary History[M] 24 points25 points  (1 child)

                                                                                  And this is why i am unsubscribing to this subreddit.

                                                                                  May I ask why?

                                                                                  Regardless of the answer, please note that top-level replies to questions in /r/AskHistorians should actually be attempts to clarify or answer the question. Your above comment is something you can keep to yourself, or even message the mods directly about if you have a formal complaint to make.

                                                                                  [–]SuperDan1348 9 points10 points  (0 children)

                                                                                  plus, this is a really interesting question, IMO.