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all 111 comments

[–]respaaaaajcustom flair 71 points72 points  (6 children)

I was hoping this was a joke about the time someone unironically tried to gas a furry convention, but this works too I guess.

[–]PoorLilMarcoNot actually a furry 32 points33 points  (3 children)

I can't wait for the inevitable day where some dude actually succeeds and furries get national attention

This would happen across all major news networks

[–]old_grumpy_grandpa 10 points11 points  (1 child)

That would turn them into martyrs tho, and I would rather not have that

[–]PoorLilMarcoNot actually a furry 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Nah, they'd still be a laughing stock. Pretty much everyone pointed and laughed when 20 of them were hospitalised, despite the fact that someone actually attempted a chemical attack on American soil

[–]Senator_Chickpea 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Never forget The Fur Ball

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 4 points5 points  (0 children)

A real American hero, tbh

[–][deleted] 54 points55 points  (5 children)

publications

There are video and book reviews, an advice column, and 3 pages of personals.

never have i wanted to know something more than what a fucking advice column in a motherfucking 90s bestiality zine consists of

[–]snallygaster[S] 31 points32 points  (2 children)

oh god same

the publisher is ded and there are no archives online, so I guess we'll never know. :'(

[–]giroth 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Not with that attitude. Don't let us down, Snally.

[–]snallygaster[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I've actually found some leads. :3

[–]defiantleek 8 points9 points  (0 children)

"Dear Barbara, recently the new stud at my farm has been giving me the bedroom(barnyard?) eyes and I've been wondering how I can best prepare myself to accept his coupling and show him just how interested I am in being his partner.

                                Your faithful reader, K. Pinyan

Ps Barbara, I distribute my art under the name Mr. Hands, if you have seen it mind giving me a friendly critique?

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

5 Neat Ways to Get Semen Stains Out Of Your Fursuit, page 8

[–][deleted] 41 points42 points  (7 children)

Now, Mark, I and my household are extremely open-minded. I myself being permanently involved in a well working three-way relationship: Kishma and Tanamin, my two mates, both being bisexual, and I myself being betero. (I have declared myself heterosexual, having experienced male sex and found absolutely no interest in it personally. But, as I said before, I am not opposed to it.)

betero

[–][deleted] 33 points34 points  (0 children)

🅱️etero

[–]MakeAmericaSageAgain 9 points10 points  (0 children)

betaro

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 10 points11 points  (3 children)

lol what the fuck does this even mean

[–]77pollu 10 points11 points  (2 children)

betero. (I have declared myself heterosexual, having experienced male sex and found absolutely no interest in it personally. But, as I said before, I am not opposed to it.)

It's right there you degenerate.

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Like that even remotely makes sense

[–]77pollu 1 point2 points  (0 children)

True.

[–]UraniumDildo 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Meirl

[–]The_Reason_Trump_Won 36 points37 points  (5 children)

Til furries weren't always degenerate

[–]pigeondoubletakecigarette 19 points20 points  (2 children)

[–]riemann1413 20 points21 points  (1 child)

that's from Confurence 8 you fucking mong

[–]wistydrink 5 points6 points  (0 children)

CF4 - http://www.confurence.com/CF4/pics/costumes/51.jpg

Here's the crowd in CF4 - http://www.confurence.com/CF4/pics/misc/27.jpg

Yeah, it's always looked like a /r/Drama meetup. Maybe CF8 went overboard a bit though.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Something doesn't have to be sexual to be degenerate. Would you tell your friendly neighborhood Gestapo officer that you have an avid interest in "anthropomorphic art and cartoons"? No? Then it's degenerate.

[–]Delicateplace 7 points8 points  (0 children)

These non-sexual furries are way more confusing to me than the gross ones. I can comprehend being sexually degenerate. But why the fuck would you be so into anthropomorphic animals otherwise? What do they get out of it? I don't understand

[–]sovietsleepover 38 points39 points  (3 children)

Snally, this is a lot of shit to read about sexual degeneracy. I am reluctantly giving this a go only because of your good name, definitely not the title.

Please let this be good.

[–]sovietsleepover 41 points42 points  (2 children)

Oh dear god what is this

[–]snallygaster[S] 26 points27 points  (0 children)

sorry

[–]Tophattingson 31 points32 points  (9 children)

You should become an internet historian. This is too high effort for /r/drama.

It looks like someone's done the early meta reporting in your first link. You could extend this to match the Internet historical epic, The Ms.Scribe Story.

[–]snallygaster[S] 5 points6 points  (6 children)

I don't think anything will ever come close to the MsScribe story, especially now that most internet communities are super impersonal so you don't really get to know users well enough to document their drama. There is the Onision saga, but that's more infuriating than funny like MsScribe.

[–]Tophattingson 5 points6 points  (4 children)

There has been a shift from interpersonal drama to group vs group drama. Reddit itself is an example of plenty of the latter. Still, plenty of it is worth recording. Although technically already "recorded" in primary sources, the true job of a historian is to make sense of primary sources to produce a secondary source. If someone were to look back at something like TheFattening now, they will not be able to make a great deal of sense of it without secondary sources. Needs to be done before internet memory fades a little.

Clearly the narrative you've presented in this post is massively incomplete.

At the very least i'm interested in whether Mark Merlino is mostly responsible for the incredibly skewed demographics of the furry fandom like being only 25% heterosexual.

[–]snallygaster[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

There has been a shift from interpersonal drama to group vs group drama. Reddit itself is an example of plenty of the latter. Still, plenty of it is worth recording. Although technically already "recorded" in primary sources, the true job of a historian is to make sense of primary sources to produce a secondary source. If someone were to look back at something like TheFattening now, they will not be able to make a great deal of sense of it without secondary sources. Needs to be done before internet memory fades a little.

This is very true, but sadly we're not at the point where anybody would pay for somebody to make secondary sources on internet history, unless you're talking about places like Vice that report heavily editorialized versions of weird events as shock material.

Clearly the narrative you've presented in this post is massively incomplete.

Oh, definitely. You'd need to interview a lot of the old-timers and gather a lot more primary resources (though who know's what's even left) to get a real picture of what happened and how it changed the fandom.

At the very least i'm interested in whether Mark Merlino is mostly responsible for the incredibly skewed demographics of the furry fandom like being only 25% heterosexual.

It sounds like his influence was pretty significant; in many of the posts people mentioned that he was recruiting from the gay community in particular. It probably snowballed through networking after he recruited enough people.

[–]Akilroth234 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Snally, were you a christorian for any stretch of time?

[–]chaosakita 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There are some weird things in that survey. Like 5% of respondents identifying as Native American, but only 3% as black. lmao

[–]Lurking_Grue 0 points1 point  (0 children)

At the very least i'm interested in whether Mark Merlino

He wasn't most young people don't really understand the underground funny animal comic culture the fandom grew out of.

This is from the fanzine Vootie in 1978: NSFW: ♫ Duck Tits! WoooOOOO ♫

[–]FreeRobotFrost 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Maybe it's time to start tracking down and interviewing people. I can tell you that plenty of people in those communities would love to give a verbal account of the bullshit that happened in their private corner of the internet.

Wasn't there a couple who wanted to homeschool their kid about furry history?

[–]BigDaddy_Delta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's dedication

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (12 children)

WORSHIP THE MOUSE, THE MOUSE IS THE WAY, THE fandom MUST BE HUMBLED BEFORE THE MIGHT MOUSE AND HIS ALL MIGHTY DOLAR! THE CONS MUST BE MADE SAFE FOR THE MOUSE! THE NET MUST BE MADE SAFE FOR THE MOUSE! THIS IS IMPERITIVE AND OVERIDES ALL OTHER PRIORITIES! (such as compassion, free speach, and common sence, for example.)

what did he mean by this?

Also snally you are the best poster in this subreddit, how the fuck do you even find this shit?

[–]snallygaster[S] 31 points32 points  (10 children)

I was checking vivesector for any new happenings and stumbled across verification that Rainfurrest (the con with a bunch of babyfurs that got a ton of attention a couple years back) was permanently cancelled, so I looked it up for more details and stumbled across this post with this comment about ConFurence 8. From there I searched "ConFurence 8" in alt.fan.furry on Google Groups (which has all usenet posts) because it was the central hub for all things furry back then and came across all this stuff.

[–]pigeondoubletakecigarette 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Oh my fucking christ snally I almost threw up my spine looking through those

[–]Masturb_Chyiff 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Are you planning on doing a retrospective on RF2015? Because that shit sounds hilarious!

[–]snallygaster[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Could do, though I imagine someone's already done a write-up.

[–]ason 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I like the one that says "at the fox yodeling panel" and it's just a gaping asshole and scrote. Best. Panel. Ever.

[–]MG87 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Or you can admit that you flick the bean to furry porn.

[–]snallygaster[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

murrrrrr~

(jk)

[–]OffendedPotato 1 point2 points  (2 children)

What the hell is a babyfur and why were they shitting in diapers at the con?

[–]snallygaster[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

A babyfur is an adult baby/diaper fetishist who's also a furry. They were shitting at the con because that's what they get off on, and somehow the event was perceived to be a place where they could be openly kinky.

[–]AntiLuke 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's saying that the desire to have a clean furry fandom is driven by Disney. "The Mouse" is used to refer to Mickey whenever people want to make jokes about totalitarian Disney.

[–]PM_ME_MOD_STATUS 17 points18 points  (6 children)

[–]Nomadlads 15 points16 points  (0 children)

If I saw this man anywhere near an elementary school, I'd call the cops.

[–]MG87 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Is that supposed to be his best picture? Jesus.

[–]chaosakita 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Wouldn't be surprised if this guy had raped someone.

[–]OffendedPotato 2 points3 points  (0 children)

He looks like a serial killer/pedophile from the 70's who definitely owns a white van.

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sweet baby Jesus

[–]crefakis 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Well, I purrsonally would like to be noticed by the ladies, but i'm very shy in public ...

I'm sure that most everyone will behave themselves, tho.

Speaking of shyness, i'm bringing definately bring my "Dragoncam", and maybe also my Kodak DC-40 digital camera

god i feel like I need a wash

[–]fingerpaintswithpoopautism 11 points12 points  (0 children)

The levels of autism in that post are off the fucking charts. Holy shit.

[–]fingerpaintswithpoopautism 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Snally I swear to God, you are like some sort of Internet archaeologist with all this old drama you manage to dig up. How do you do it?

[–]pigeondoubletakecigarette 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You better watch that smart mouth of yours boy, before I poop 💩 in your mouth so hard you'll cry yourself to death.

[–]AreYouFuckingHappy 12 points13 points  (3 children)

I hope you have bad dremes tonite OP

[–]snallygaster[S] 12 points13 points  (2 children)

that's not a very nice thing to say!

[–]AreYouFuckingHappy 3 points4 points  (1 child)

😄😙

[–]snallygaster[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I had a couple of nightmares last night asshole and I blame YOU.

[–]Imgur_Lurker 12 points13 points  (12 children)

I was shopping and I found this today Tin Sign. Right next to the Farmers/Firefighters/Truckers are the backbone of America Sign and Elvis fixen the Nascar with Monroe

[–]snallygaster[S] 3 points4 points  (11 children)

what were you even shopping for to stumble across that?

[–]Imgur_Lurker 12 points13 points  (10 children)

Gurl.

Gurl a Redneck Furry isn't even in the running for what I saw this shopping trip.

The Bear was just in normal Tin Store tacky shirt store "I'm a white women and I love Wine" , Nascar Tin, Comic Tin stuff.

This other stuff is on a whole nother level.

http://imgur.com/a/gobxb

[–]Works_of_memercy 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Why no nipples? Were they afraid of seeming lewd?

[–]snallygaster[S] 2 points3 points  (8 children)

oh my god, where can you buy those?

[–]Imgur_Lurker 4 points5 points  (7 children)

[–]snallygaster[S] 1 point2 points  (6 children)

thanks, gonna throw away some money today

edit: aw man, you can't order online.

[–]OffendedPotato 4 points5 points  (5 children)

Get /u/Imgur_Lurker to buy one and send it to you. i want you to have this.

[–]snallygaster[S] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

good idea!

there also seems to be shops that sell them in my area, so might make a visit.

[–]Imgur_Lurker 1 point2 points  (3 children)

http://www.kkringl.com/ is the store I saw them in.

( Also sells African-American Elfs and Santas and Indian Nativity scenes)

[–]snallygaster[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Thanks man, that's actually within driving distance.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Iris Chang is one of my favorite authors. She's the historian who wrote The Rape of Nanking. It was the last book she published before she an hero'd herself in a car outside her house, because the subject matter was too grim, and got to her too much.

If Prof. Chang had to do Snally's job, her book never would have even made it to press.

[–]Akilroth234 1 point2 points  (1 child)

There are aspects of my experience in Louisville that I will never understand. Deep down I suspect that you may have more answers about this than I do. I can never shake my belief that I was being recruited, and later persecuted, by forces more powerful than I could have imagined. Whether it was the CIA or some other organization I will never know. As long as I am alive, these forces will never stop hounding me.

Days before I left for Louisville I had a deep foreboding about my safety. I sensed suddenly threats to my own life: an eerie feeling that I was being followed in the streets, the white van parked outside my house, damaged mail arriving at my P.O. Box. I believe my detention at Norton Hospital was the government's attempt to discredit me.

Think she might have had schizophrenia.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Probably. It never manifested itself before, but idk. It made me mad sad tho, unironically.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Merlino had a house in Southern California that he promoted as a place for people in the furry fandom to gather.

So, wait, this is distinct from the other house for unevictable internet weirdos that you posted about before?

[–]snallygaster[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yup, that was a house for Stickam whores

[–]riemann1413 10 points11 points  (0 children)

user reports:
1: Nobody fucking cares

that's hurtful tbh

[–]riemann1413 10 points11 points  (6 children)

this is something of a sad story, honestly. i'm just imagining a sad weekender furry who lost his hobby because of these people

[–]PoorLilMarcoNot actually a furry 11 points12 points  (5 children)

It makes me wonder what would have happened to the fandom if Merlino didn't exist. Would they have stayed as overly eccentric Disney fans or would it have only delayed the inevitable?

[–]riemann1413 12 points13 points  (4 children)

that's a good question. i wonder if there's a comparable fandom that resisted the alt-lifestyle types better than furries

/u/snallygaster, do you know?

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 9 points10 points  (2 children)

we all know Bronies didn't

[–]PoorLilMarcoNot actually a furry 9 points10 points  (1 child)

The brony fandom was first started by furries on 4chan's /co/ board, it was doomed from the start.

[–]Ikea_Manamerica 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Why does everything evil originate on 4chan

[–]snallygaster[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

hmmm, good question. Maybe some of the bigger subcultures by virtue of the fact that there aren't enough alt-lifestylers to take over even though they make up a part of the community, like New Age or some of the nerd groups. The ren faire community also has a lot of alt lifestylers while still remaining family friendly for the most part. There are also a lot of subcultures that were never really hit with alt-lifestyle elements. It never factored into the otherkin and therian communities even though there were certainly many alt-lifestylers, which is kind of strange if you think about it because the vampire community (which has a lot of overlap with the otherkin/therian community) got hit HARD.

[–]PepperglueWill donate for flairs 9 points10 points  (3 children)

Snally delivers again. This thing is about 20 years old, wow.

The year was 1997

By the time 1997 rolled in, the Confurence had been held seven times

They got really busy within one year.

Although some of these things are now commonplace at furry conventions

Jesus Christ. Within one year the guy can change so much about a fandom tells me that the fandom might have not been so innocent after all, or it was just really small?

[–]snallygaster[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Merlino had been changing the fandom over the course of a few years, and there were some alt lifestylers who found their way in without his help, so it wasn't too immediate. ConFurence 8 is just when things came to a head due to a much larger amount of open debauchery compared to the previous cons.

[–]imaginarycreatures 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I can only speak from my own experience, but having gone to a few "furry parties" at sci-fi conventions in the early 90's, there was always a sexual undercurrent, but they were still really good at keeping it in their pants, as it were.

I actually met Mark on one or two occasions, when Confurence was still getting off the ground. He was definitely passionate about his interests, though he never really mentioned anything sexual to me. Of course, I would have been in my teens at the time, so....

[–]PoorLilMarcoNot actually a furry 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I actually met Mark on one or two occasions

You could have prevented all this

[–]wistydrink 9 points10 points  (1 child)

The problem wasn't the degeneracy, it was that they put the degeneracy front and center, and invited a film crew.

You think the fetishwear started in CF7? Here's CF5 - http://www.confurence.com/CF5/pics/costumes/LR43.jpg

[–]LovelyLeahMarried 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I can't decide if the guy on the left is really short, or if he just looks that way because he's not in a costume.

I also can't decide if he's 20 or 40.

[–]SamWhite 8 points9 points  (0 children)

You pathetic excuse for a man, have you NO morals? Do you not care AT ALL?

How DARE you use his misfortune like this to promote yourself and your misguided dollar driven ideals.

WORSHIP THE MOUSE, THE MOUSE IS THE WAY, THE fandom MUST BE HUMBLED BEFORE THE MIGHT MOUSE AND HIS ALL MIGHTY DOLAR! THE CONS MUST BE MADE SAFE FOR THE MOUSE! THE NET MUST BE MADE SAFE FOR THE MOUSE! THIS IS IMPERITIVE AND OVERIDES ALL OTHER PRIORITIES! (such as compassion, free speach, and common sence, for example.)

Uh, what?

[–]BasicallyADoctorTrust me, I'm a doctor 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Wow bro you really typed lots of words 😮 neat drama though thanks!

[–]addmeontinder 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I still don't like you

[–]Dirty_Urchin 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I have read this post, and it sent me to some places I've never been. Spent another three hours wandering the internet, researching a subject I had zero interest in. That's how good your post is. So damned satisfying.

[–]snallygaster[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What did you find?

[–]guyjin 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Damnit snally, now we have all this furry shit in my Web history just as congress legalized my ISP selling it. The furry death squads are surely coming for us now!

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Here are some details about Mark's ties to early anime fandom.

TL;DR he was in the C/FO and was one of the first people in the LA fandom to have a VCR.

[–]ason 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Your post reminded me of this fucking adult Peter Pan guy for some reason. Thanks a lot, jerk.

[–]SnapshillBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Providing a Safe Space™ from SRD since 2009!

Snapshots:

  1. This Post - archive.org, megalodon.jp, ceddit.com, archive.is*

  2. Mark Merlino - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  3. "Ed Klein's Letter" - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  4. "Confurence 8 Observations" - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  5. "An Appeal to Mark Merlino" - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  6. "Afraid of the truth?" - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  7. "Confurence Public Affairs (what is... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  8. "ConFurence 8 -- Hotel Notes" - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

I am a bot. (Info / Contact)

[–]LovelyLeahMarried 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why are furries so disgusting?

[–]Dirty_Urchin 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Not finished yet, waiting for the weekend, a couple of beers. It really has the feel of one man changing a whole fandom simply to fulfil a fetish. It had a feel to it that it was a reason for some awkward dudes to have a reason to get together and bang. Definitely what appears to have happened at RF. l can't imagine how bizarre that crossover would have been, families with kids, men in fur and diapers. It's a really interesting cross section of people. I also want to know what happened to that guy, the one who kind of started the whole sexualisation of the furry community (I read it two days ago, it's Friday afternoon and my brain is fried). You've provided such an awesome snapshot of a particular time in that community. I love that it's made me so curious. Edit-Mark Merlino. What happened to him? Edit because I found some beers. So after some more stalking it appears that there was an acknowledgement of the split between furry fans and anthromorphs, or lifestylers. The hate for some of the lifestylers was perceived by some as being an easy coverall for homophobia rather than a direct reflection of community behaviour. Interesting, so one side saw shitty behaviour, the other saw lack of acceptance. Merlino appears to still be active, just not so much.

[–]Lurking_Grue 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Always family friendly? What crack are you smoking?

It was never family friendly and the subculture grew out of underground funny animal comics.

Did you ever read Omaha the Cat dancer?

Here is footage from the first convention in 1989:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymFjgpcapx8