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[–]zilpe 7 points8 points  (8 children)

There are... They're considered nootropics more than recreational stimulants though. There still isn't much info on them despite them being available for awhile https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GTS-21 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galantamine Supposedly they have applications for lucid dreaming as well, nicotine itself is said to help with this. I was interested in these because they were supposedly good for focus and concentration but when I took Galantamine I had also been taking memantine semi-regularly which is an antagonist of nicotinic ach receptors with a long half-life so I didn't really notice anything.

[–]shrillthrill 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Galantamine is nootropic? In this study it impaired WM and recognition in healthy people.

[–]FortunateLee 9 points10 points  (2 children)

That's the coolest thing about the nootropic scene - half the stuff people recommend actually makes you dumber

[–]zilpe 1 point2 points  (1 child)

If phenibut is a nootropic then what isn't.

[–]shrillthrill 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's not really considered nootropic unless used sparingly. Most phenibut posts have been relegated to /r/phenibut due to the amount of abuse/recreational posts.

[–]zilpe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well probably not, it seems to have a positive effect for Alzhimers so that's enough for it to get branded as a nootropic by the market. I have no idea what the rationale was for the vendor picking up this particular chemical. I guess I had been reading reports for GTS-21 and was very attracted to the idea of something which could provide the focus and sense of well-being that nicotine does without being grossly stimulating.

[–]hypnagoggle 1 point2 points  (1 child)

So you're saying you agree with item 3 in OP's list?

[–]zilpe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sort of, cholinergic nootropics usually refer to things like choline or Alpha-GPC which increase the amount of AcH in the brain. Nicotinic AcH agonists (Or PAMs in the case of Galantamine) seem to be much less studied in the nootropic world.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Lucid dream is not the right word for a nicotine dream. That's like calling diphenhydramine psychedelic.

[–]snaqr 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Interesting point, I hadn't thought about nicotine but I have wondered why there are no RC versions of otherwise popular compounds like benzoylmethylecgonine (coke) or caffeine.

[–]sum_ergo_sum 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think benzoylmethylecgonine's structure is hard to synthesize for one reason or another. All coke still comes from cocoa leaves. For caffeine, I guess things like guarana or taurine in energy drinks are almost like research chemical versions

[–]ElectricRecess 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I know it's not an RC, but wouldn't Wellbutrin kinda be something like what you're looking for?

[–]SlimSlamtheFlimFlam 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not at all. It's a noncompetitive antagonist at several nicotinic receptors (most importantly, at the α4β2 and α3β4 receptors) - basically the opposite to what he's looking for.

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[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (13 children)

Nicotine isn't recreational to most people, that's all the reason you need

[–]gwern[S] 2 points3 points  (11 children)

People find smoking and vaping quite recreational, both for stimulation and relaxation. That's part of why it's one of the most popular drugs ever. And lack of recreational value doesn't stop modafinil.

[–]polydook 1 point2 points  (10 children)

People like the act of smoking/vaping, although the slight stimulation from the nicotine probably adds a bit to it. Modafinil has little recreational value, but it's a functional stimulant. People use it to increase their productivity. Nicotine has little functional value.

[–]gwern[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nicotine has plenty of functional value; the psychology studies and meta-analyses for non-addicts look fairly similar to modafinil. Subjectively, I'd say that they're similar (with the caveat of the dratted too-short half-life).

[–]Propyl_People_Ether 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Nicotine has a lot of functional value if, like me, you have dopaminergic system ADHD and a family history of Parkinson's (the risk of which is reduced by nicotine). I was scared off it for a number of years because cigarettes are terrible, but read up on it and realized that the patches aren't more addictive than a run-of-the-mill antidepressant, and that in a society where doctors had some idea about my neurotype and nicotine wasn't exclusively associated with tobacco smoking in the public eye, someone would probably have told me to go on them years ago.

As a bonus they treat POTS.

[–]zilpe 1 point2 points  (2 children)

You are 100% wrong. Nicotine can be insanely euphoric, in combination with other drugs especially. I don't think I've ever felt better than I did when smoking a cigarette after my first M-hole. The functional value is mainly impeded by it's short duration, exactly why nicotinic RCs would be of interest.

[–]Sherlockian_Holmes 0 points1 point  (1 child)

That is a poor anecdote to substantiate your view. There are other substances in tobacco in cigarettes than just nicotine. Nicotine by itself is not as addicting as in the combination with MAO-inhibitors present in tobacco such as harmane and norhamane.

[–]zilpe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm aware, but vaped nicotine has also been extremely euphoric to me. There is no denying nicotine is a recreational substance which is capable of triggering a sense of well being. I don't know why people have this idea that nicotine is only borderline psychoactive or something, it's a great stimulant it just has a terribly short half-life.