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all 19 comments

[–]mcjunkerWar Nerd 12 points13 points  (3 children)

I used to have that problem, then I bought a fuckload of socks at once.

Now I can't get through them all in before doing laundry, so I have some pairs of socks that aren't ever worn and some that are wearing out; some of my socks are high quality, some are walmart quality, and I never know which will be which till I get up to get dressed for work.

I do laundry and they never fucking match, too.

I swear to God I want to set all my socks on fire and buy a set amount of nice socks that will last me exactly as long as my laundry cycle does, and which are all interchangeable, but I don't want to pay out to get the peace of mind.

Socks are a fucking problem, man.

[–]kiztent 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I buy 10 pairs of identical socks whenever I run low and currently have 2 different weekday socks and 2 different weekend socks (40 pairs less wear).

I wash underthings every 2 weeks, so I have a sock buffer.

I'm a huge believer in everything matches everything. Any pair of pants I have matches any shirt. Clothing is not worth wasting cognitive bandwidth on.

[–]erkelep 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Jesus, just buy ten pairs of the exact same socks and use them at random.

[–]mcjunkerWar Nerd 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ten pairs doesn’t get me through the laundry cycle, and buying more than that is like an $80 investment I don’t want to make.

Also, taking a frivolous issue extremely seriously is one of the ways I joke.

[–]partoffuturehivemind[the Seven Secular Sermons guy] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Socks are a recommended gift if you want to help homeless people. Very few of them have adequate socks and they are not a thing you can easily trade for something that makes your situation worse.

[–]citrinitae 6 points7 points  (3 children)

Gwern talks about a system where having enough socks is attained by carefulness / checklists / calendar software. But I can imagine a system where the "do I have enough socks?" line item is completely eliminated by shipping me 1.3 socks every month, or by a robot that sorts my laundry, or some other technological progress. For example, I think "do I have enough firewood to keep warm?" has been mostly obsoleted.

Solving the sock problem for myself is probably more effort than it's worth, but if the benefits could be shared amongst everyone short of socks, it suddenly seems less futile. At this point, is it viable to automate to the point that daily life is more or less "solved"? I'm sure everyone will have their odd unique tasks, but reducing the cognitive load by, say, 80% seems very attractive.

On the other hand, this could train people away from the conscientiousness that the rest of the post focuses on. It could also be replacing a working system with a more complex one that is even more prone to decay. I still think there are gains to be had, because I'd very much rather spend my time thinking about the things I like than what I need to make it through the month.

[–]gwern[S] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Robots that sort your laundry don't really exist and to the extent that they do, I am suspicious they will ever be cost-effective. (Although DRL roboticists keep talking about the dream of a robot that can fold your clothes, which is closer than ever, even the ultra-cheap robot arms are still thousands of dollars for the hardware, so how does that compete, with their overhead and breaking down, with a human doing it? Like an immigrant.)

There are a lot of sock subscription services (I shouldn't've been surprised) but I wasn't sure whether to mention them. My attitude is that such services tend to come with a lot of hidden drawbacks when your goal is to save time/effort, which was the point of my XKCD links: it's very easy for automation to backfire and become part of the problem. You sign up for a service, and then your package goes missing. Or you have to return it. Or a year in, the service folds, before you've even amortized the time it took to research which service you wanted. Or you get socks you don't want. Or the socks are just awful expensive (as the services I looked at were). Or... It is hard to compete with what I did, which was just buy a big batch of socks to solve it for a few years.

I was recently burned by a subscription service. My cat loves the Purina salmon pate canned wet cat food more than any other wet cat food I've tried, and others will be a bit wasted. I can buy the seafood variety pack locally no problem, but not an all-salmon pate. Online, all-salmon packs exist but are easily 2-3x the cost. Finally, after a good deal of hunting online for alternatives, I found Petco.com offered them at hardly a 10% markup and as a monthly subscription as well - perfect! I was pleased with myself. I signed up, set up a subscription, and got a shipment once a month with no additional effort, my cat was much happier, less food was wasted, and it cost about the same. And it did indeed work perfectly for about 3 months. Until you know what Petco decided to do? They banned all Purina products from their store, on the grounds of banning "all dog and cat food and treats that contain artificial ingredients". So instead they shipped me a package of 'organic' salmon pate which cost like 50% more and my cat instantly hated and would eat only after starving overnight. (Fuck you and your virtue-signaling pseudo-science bullshit, Petco, and catering to the ignorant masses. Is there even a single real study demonstrating all-cause mortality changes? I doubt it. And you know what's worse for my cat than 'artificial ingredients'? Eating food he hates.) So after all that, it wound up being an almost total waste of time: I then had to go and cancel, and find some alternative. No one else has stepped up to the plate and offered something as cheap, so currently I'm going to my local Walmart and simply buying every single salmon pate they have in stock. (Last time I managed to score 70 cans, so I'm good for under 2 months.)

[–]derpotologist 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I generally have the same attitude about subscription services but I'm doing one of the underwear ones... I always forget to buy new underwear... mine go way too long before replacing them. I can't find that quality at my local stores (~20 minute drive to find comparable quality) and they're cheaper than the good stuff locally. Been super happy with it

The dog toy subscription service was good to me as well, but only if I turned it on for 2-3 months at a time, otherwise the treats piled up and went unused.. and I have multiple dogs. Anyone who feeds their dog that amount of treats every month has a fat dog, put that on my mama

[–]stugy 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I bought like 20 pairs of the same sock several years ago, and it's been great. I went to refresh them by buying 6 pairs of the exact same sock, and of course now they are cheaply made and some of them are falling apart after only a couple wears. It feels like every purchase requires a ton of research nowadays. True quality varies a lot, is hard to judge, and every brand improves and degrades so quickly. There used to be this sweet spot a few years ago when Amazon reviews were more trustworthy, and Reddit wasn't being astroturfed, and even online reviews weren't an SEO-optimised mess where you could really research the quality of products. I'm buying so many things this year like a washing machine and a bicycle and kitchen tools, and every purchase requires so much uncertain research. Doing the same for socks just seems so exhausting. It's no wonder I'm putting it off until I run out again

[–][deleted]  (2 children)

[deleted]

    [–]dualmindbladewe have nothing to lose but our fences 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    I'm having trouble seeing the sock angle here.

    [–]surveysaysyougreat 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Our family has a pretty solid tradition of sock-giving at Christmas, (I know, I know, but we make it fun.) and this has systematized updating the sock stock.

    Though the problem is that inevitably we end up with an abundance of great winter socks. And I continue to not have enough lighter summer socks.

    [–]Ashen_Light 3 points4 points  (1 child)

    Step 1: buy 20+ pairs of socks

    Step 2: never lose your socks

    Step 3: repeat every 5-10 years.

    Problem rendered trivial.

    I'm memeing a bit, but I actually sort of think this is a good solution (and it really is what I do personally).

    Note we do need to invoke System II, but the demands are so much lower, because "remember to do advanced planning thing once every few months" really could be forgotten or procrastinated, but "remember to do advanced planning thing once every 5 years and it doesn't matter at all if it's 7 years rather than 5 years" is completely trivial.

    The difficulties really only lie in actually making the Step 1 decision (most people won't or perhaps can't for financial reasons) and doing Step 2, which is arguably harder, but also is a transferrable skill that is helpful for like, being good at everything.

    [–]remizidae 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Yeah, I’ve never had this problem either.

    [–]right-folded 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Ha! Of all the problems I have, this is not one of them. And not because I'm highly conscientious or anything, I just buy some socks whenever I see them, lol.

    [–]JohnofCharleston 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    I have too many socks because I keep trying brands I don't like, after my go-to brand was discontinued a decade ago. They're a disaster to sort. Someday when I find my new platonic ideal sock I'll replace them all with one massive Amazon order. The trick is finding a sock I like.

    When I saw a Gwern post about socks, I thought my problems were solved! But there was no rank-ordered list of sock recommendations. How un-Gwern-like.

    [–]gwern[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    When I saw a Gwern post about socks, I thought my problems were solved! But there was no rank-ordered list of sock recommendations. How un-Gwern-like.

    Socks are all pretty much the same to me. One ankle sock is about the same as another ankle sock, one thick sock is like another thick sock... If I did a lot of hiking or other sock-strenuous habits, I might have more of an opinion, but for just taking my daily walk and whatnot, anything will do.

    [–]riverjustice 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    That was pleasant read. However, I think having a low pile of socks is inconsequential even if you go down to one pair. Whereas a lack of insurance, you're faced with a monumental consequence. You might argue using a Swiss Cheese Model that losing a pair of socks can lead up to a certain event that changes the course of one's life. But I beg to differ. With all things said, I have a system of replacing socks because of the annoyance it gives me.

    [–]gwern[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    If it annoys you, then it surely can't be unimportant. Annoyed people aren't at their best.